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AndrewB
Joined: 06 Apr 2008
Posts: 3
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 Posted: Sun Apr 06, 2008 5:25 pm Post subject: SB4 - Vatsim - vroute and any other online |
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Folks,
I have been checking this forum everyday for months to see if SB4 has been released. I have not flown online since FSX came out as each day I convince myself SB4 is imminent. In addition there are great online tools to be used eg vroute if you where flying online. Alas these tools are not much good if we do not have SB4. (I know there is an alternative) There are a lot of comments in the forum about being patient (its only a hobby etc) I would have thought that Vatsim would want to encourage more members and continue to build the great online community. While I appreciate there is other option, SB3 and I am sure SB4 are so simple and effective even a novice could get online without to much trouble. Please can we have a date for release as I do not want to go to the trouble of installing FS9 (which I should have done months ago) If it assistance you are after I am happy to help (I have medium program/computer skills) Please do not take this message as criticism.
Regards,
Andrew
OZ |
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bal464
Joined: 07 Apr 2008
Posts: 9
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| Posted: Mon Apr 07, 2008 8:39 am Post subject: |
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Hi all, I'm a newbie to these forums but an oldie when it comes to flight simming (sigh, such an oldie). I've been using the excellent FSInn for years but lately it's giving me problems with FSX. It's officially not compatibile so I count myself lucky to have use it for so long but FSX SP2 has caused quite a few problems to bubble up and FSInn is now causing random problems that mean I can 't fly online. So I guess I'm joining the countless ranks who look pleadingly in the direction of Squawkbox4 every day and quietly mouth the words "pleeeeeeease".
I don't want to appear to be begging for freeware - I'm happy to help so if I can do anything to help it go live let me know. I'm a middle aged cockpit builder with 20 years of MS Flight sim under my belt, I work in IT as a developer and have written my own interfaces (thanks to FSUIPC!) so if I can be of any use as a tester I'd be happy to give you the time and the effort (no NDAs though, I have a BIG mouth, lol!).
All the best
Ian |
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Paul
Joined: 13 Jan 2006
Posts: 54
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| Posted: Mon Apr 07, 2008 1:10 pm Post subject: |
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Tin Hats on everyone ....
Heads down ..... take cover ...
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GregV
Joined: 30 Oct 2006
Posts: 120
Location: Chicago, IL
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| Posted: Mon Apr 07, 2008 3:49 pm Post subject: |
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Well, it has been quiet here for a week... Someone was bound to bring it up  |
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sweker
Joined: 08 Mar 2008
Posts: 6
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| Posted: Mon Apr 07, 2008 7:12 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | so perhaps the approach next time should be to remain 'completely quiet' or have a volunteer (I'd do it) to provide regular updates to the community |
Perhaps my previous post was taken literally. Unfortunately, I meant next time, its too late for the silent treatment!  |
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Jamzes
Joined: 28 Feb 2008
Posts: 8
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| Posted: Mon Apr 07, 2008 8:40 pm Post subject: |
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Just get FSInn. It's easy to use and its developers are a lot more professional. They recognize it's more than a hobby to most people. In My opinion, if you don't intend to keep the ball rolling on your product, regardless of whether it's paid or not, then do the right thing-get out of the business and stop misleading people. Squawkbox developers just plain don't care about their own project enough to bother getting out an important release soon enough to all the people who cared about the program and used it on a regular basis. At some point you just have to take a hint.
I have a feeling I will get censored for this post, but that alone will say a lot in this post's place. |
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Norman
Joined: 26 May 2004
Posts: 1583
Location: N Ireland
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| Posted: Tue Apr 08, 2008 3:35 am Post subject: |
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James,
You probably missed the head of FSInn's announcement that he stopped work on FSInn over 8 months ago - at least SB is still being develoiped. Given your comments, should they too get out of the game?
People are more than welcome to try out FSInn - I have it installed (thanks to Larry's instructions) but can't recall the last time I actually used it to connect to VATSIM.
Whilst a public beta could have been done last year the preference is to have something that is able to install and run without any major issue having followed (or worse not!) a complex set of instructions.
The plan is to see a full release of SB, unlike its namesake Sb2.3 and most probably it's cousin which remain in perpetual beta. |
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GregV
Joined: 30 Oct 2006
Posts: 120
Location: Chicago, IL
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| Posted: Tue Apr 08, 2008 8:07 am Post subject: |
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I'm confused.... This from the FSINN forums in December...
| Code: | | First I would like to mention that FSInn1.3 beta is very stable. It’s basically waiting for the completion of the Weather installation ( http://www.mcdu.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=4486 ) which is still in development. The only issues I see with FSInn is the performance issue with FS9 ( http://www.mcdu.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=4112&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0 ). FS9 users might consider sticking with the older version 1.2 if they are bothered by the FSInn1.3’s performance. Neither FSX or Vista is supported under FSInn1.2. FSInn1.3 has full support for both. |
Norman, would that not suggest they're still developing and have a public beta? |
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bal464
Joined: 07 Apr 2008
Posts: 9
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| Posted: Tue Apr 08, 2008 8:31 am Post subject: |
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My understanding is that FSInn as it is is a dead project. I seem to remember reading some postings that hinted the developers were thoroughly fed up with the attitude of many of their users. Understandable really, some were extremely abusive over what was freeware. After months of inactivity I saw new postings that suggested Alexander and/or Benjamin would consider writing a cut-down version of FSinn. No fancy add-ons, just a simple connect and talk on-line app but I've no idea whether this was ever put into development.
I should emphasise that the only problem I get using FSInn 1.3 with FSX is a random glitch in FSCopilot that seems to flood the FSX storage areas with nonesense, tipping my aircraft into an unrecoverable pirhouette. None of my controls respond and the only option is to kill FSX. It's intermittent and usually pops up an FSCopilot message box reporting an error but since it seems to happen at the end of flight it's not a viable way to connect to VATSIM for me. I realise that's a lot of detail but many people read these postings and a) I don't want the boys at MCDU to misinterperet my earlier post as a criticism of FSInn and b) maybe someone out there figured out a fix for this.
I don't know what the future holds for FSInn which is a pity, I think it's a fantastic bit of kit and I wish the team well. For now all eyes seem turned towards SB4 and unless there's a third alternative (FSX's built in multiplayer excepted) I'd imagine there's an awful lot of people holding their breaths |
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Jamzes
Joined: 28 Feb 2008
Posts: 8
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| Posted: Tue Apr 08, 2008 10:07 am Post subject: |
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Norman,
I understand what you are saying, but for now FSInn is the only reputable program that at least works for FSX since the its beta release recently. SB4 has yet to realize any sort of functionality. It is in development and has been in development for a very long time. FSX has been out for more than a year and has been unsupported by SB so far.I just don't understand why people bother creating these programs if they do not intend to keep up the pace with the changing needs of the flight sim community. VATSIM doesn't make things easier by refusing to allow payware connection programs either. So yes, FSInn should not bother to stick around, but it sounds like that is what they intend to do anyways- which is what I originally advocated for. |
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Jamzes
Joined: 28 Feb 2008
Posts: 8
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| Posted: Tue Apr 08, 2008 10:08 am Post subject: |
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| Also, I fly on VATSIM with no issues whatsoever using the latest beta of FSInn. If people are having issues with VISTA and FSX then they haven't taken the time to set it up properly then. |
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Paul
Joined: 13 Jan 2006
Posts: 54
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| Posted: Tue Apr 08, 2008 11:09 am Post subject: |
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Norman!!!!!
| Quote: | People are more than welcome to try out FSInn - I have it installed (thanks to Larry's instructions) but can't recall the last time I actually used it to connect to VATSIM.
Yeah ... that's because you are already having the luxury of using SB4!!
I rest my case |
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dweese
Joined: 02 Nov 2002
Posts: 1720
Location: Belleville ON Canada
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| Posted: Tue Apr 08, 2008 1:48 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | After months of inactivity I saw new postings that suggested Alexander and/or Benjamin would consider writing a cut-down version of FSinn. No fancy add-ons, just a simple connect and talk on-line app but I've no idea whether this was ever put into development.
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Can't see that happening, than it would just be the same as SB |
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bstevenson
Joined: 08 Apr 2008
Posts: 6
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| Posted: Tue Apr 08, 2008 3:13 pm Post subject: |
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i've been waiting patiently and watching the development of SB4 for awhile now. Like everyone else i'm waiting for it so i can try FSX online. However, recent posts have made me sign up and want to speak out.
Not against the developers but against some of the posters here.
If you are tired of waiting for SB4 then why don't you go develop your own application to connect FSX to VATSIM??
The devs spend their free time making this and trying to get it right FOR US. They are doing this FOR US, FOR FREE!!! Stop complaining and have some patience for something you don't have to pay for, it'll be out when it's ready. I for one am looking forward to the release and am glad the devs are taking their time on it so there aren't any bugs when it does come out. |
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Jamzes
Joined: 28 Feb 2008
Posts: 8
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| Posted: Tue Apr 08, 2008 7:44 pm Post subject: |
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| bstevenson wrote: | i've been waiting patiently and watching the development of SB4 for awhile now. Like everyone else i'm waiting for it so i can try FSX online. However, recent posts have made me sign up and want to speak out.
Not against the developers but against some of the posters here.
If you are tired of waiting for SB4 then why don't you go develop your own application to connect FSX to VATSIM??
The devs spend their free time making this and trying to get it right FOR US. They are doing this FOR US, FOR FREE!!! Stop complaining and have some patience for something you don't have to pay for, it'll be out when it's ready. I for one am looking forward to the release and am glad the devs are taking their time on it so there aren't any bugs when it does come out. |
Nice try but the issue isn't about cost since a lot of people would be happy to pay for SB4 if it were allowed. They do not offer it free as some sort of community service. VATSIM sets regulations that prohibit payware connection programs so that point is moot. It has to be free. And if the customer base wasn't so readily led to believe an actual release was coming out every few months then that would be fine. I'd rather a post just go up saying...you know what, we don't anticipate the program coming out any time soon so figure something else out for yourself. WHat is actually being said is this:
SB4 was introduced in October 2006 when Joel says "As you already know, I'm working away on SquawkBox 4 for FSX. Here is a brief list of the items remaining in that effort....
Getting a version to the current list of beta testers is not very far away. And since I appreciate that many of you would prefer early access to a less-than-perfect version over waiting for the final release, I plan on doing a public beta when the product is ready for that. Such an arrangement would require VATSIM approval of course but I think it's the best way to go with this release.
As always, stay posted to this page for further updates!"
Then in May 2007..."...the last internal testing build in the October most of the core functionality was completed. There isn't really much left to do to get this going..."
Then in October 2007..."the work on SB4 has been mostly complete for months now..."
February 2008..."We have a candidate build on which we are running some tests with a few pilots. After that we will submit it to VATSIM for approval and it will be released publicly."
Now it is April 2008...and since October 2006 there is still nothing. Just more messages about beta testing and more beta testing.
So, yes there is a very valid reason to be somewhat miffed because the constant message is that it's almost done...just a bit more...any day now....wait, just a final update etc...and nothing. Paying or not, just like any volunteer organization, once you begin performing some sort of service you are expected to act in a manner consistent with the performance of that task. It is unacceptable to use the fact you are volunteering as a way of negating any responsibility for your service.
And don't forget, there is already options for connecting to VATSIM in FSX (i.e. FSInn) so creating your own program is not necessary. The whole point is that there are a lot of people who were dedicated to using SB, people who gave meaning to all the work the developers accomplish with every release. That is how we return the thanks for all the hard work-by using their program and becoming part of the SB community. As a community we have been let down by the very people who created it. |
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